Subject: $1000 T2 R&D Tourney Report (Seattle) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 08:06:02 GMT From: jfuller@olywa.net (Jeremy Fuller) To: fkusumot@ix.netcom.com $1000 R&D T2 tourney Jeremy Fuller Hey.. this is a report for a $1000 (total) unsanctioned T2 tourney held at the WotC Game Center in Seattle Saturday, Nov. 15th. It's unsanctioned because there are about 20 WotC employees playing (Richard Garfield, Tom Wylie, Andrew Finch, Mark Rosewater, etc etc etc). First prize is $500, 2nd is $300, 3rd/4th is $100. Before I go on, here's a little history of what I played and why I played it. I played 5CG (yes, that old deck that did well at one tournament in its history). Most people find it scrubby because of its concept and because a lot of scrubs do play it. Anyway, I did a LOT of testing with it (well, maybe not a LOT, but it was a lot for a scrub like me). Here's what I expected the field to be: 'The Big 3': * Bloom (obvious.. I expected some of the good players to play this).. 5CG is a little better than 50/50 with this. I'm 2-2 in tournaments against bloom with 5cg. It seems like 5cg would wreck bloom, but it doesn't seem to work that way. It just doesn't have enough raw countermagic or fast beatdown to deal with it. The only real way to WIN w/5cg against bloom is geddon. BUT, I felt I could find out how many people were ACTUALLY going to be playing bloom, and s/b accordingly on saturday. (Zur's Weirdings, etc) It turned out that only one person I know of played bloom, I think (Brian Wilson) and he went 0-2 drop or something * Propaganda .. like, everyone was trading for Propagandas the day before the tourney.. so I expected a lot. To put it short, I've never lost a game agaisnt Propaganda with 5CG. I've played about 10 games.. maybe I'm not playing against the right decks, but I just wasn't worried about it much. It turned out that there might have been some Propaganda, but it didn't look like there was much at the top tables. The only one I saw anywhere near the top was played by Tom Wylie. * Monored. This, in general, is good against my deck. Yeah, Maro, Geddon, Granger, Incinerate, Terror, Hydroblast, \/\/. It just doesn't work well. It'll beat monored about 40% of the time before s/b, and about 60% of the time after s/b. It obviously varies though depending on the deck, and the draw. This can colorhose my deck REALLY easily, by killing birds, quirions + wastelands. This deck is a reason why I chose the mana I did. I didn't worry about this too much though, because in general the 'good' players around here don't play decks like this. I didn't really fear scrubby players playing monored. Other Threats: * White Weenie. I've gone like 3478852347-0 vs. white weenie with this. Like Forest, Granger = Win. Also, terrors, incinerates, Maros, Geddons, bla bla bla. I wasn't worried about this at all, even though I expected it to show up a bunch (mark justice won the T2 the night before with white weenie). Mark Justice, Max Suver and Javier Garavito all played this deck. * Monoblue. Firewalkers are about the only real threat here. Monoblue almost always holds dead counters near the end.. Centaurs and Boas are amazing against this also. I think Will Hilts was the only one playing this. * Red/Blue, Necro, Stompy, Marogeddon, Forgotten Orb, U/W Control. I didn't see these as big enough threats to worry about (I was right). If a good player happened to be playing one of these, I just hoped my deck was versitile enough to deal with it. So, anyway, I playtested this a lot and this was the deck that I came up with: _____FULLER 5CG_____ =) 4 Maro 3 Centaur 4 Boa 4 Granger 4 Ranger 4 Birds 4 Incinerate 3 Terror 4 Lapse 4 Geddon 3 Disenchant 2 City of Brass 3 Gemstone Mine 4 Undiscovered 10 Forest s/b: 4 Pyroblast 4 Hydroblast 2 Sleight of Mind 2 Zur's Weirding 1 Disenchant 1 Terror 1 Serenity Looks crappy, but whatever. It works well. After this tourney I'm 16-2-1 with it in tourneys (20-4-1 if you count a crappy version I played a while back). Things I'd change: 1 City, 4 Gemstones (Cities SUCK w/ fast creatures (white weenie etc) and monored rampant), 4 gemstones 4 undiscovered isn't really that bad in this deck, especially w/ wastelands against you, heh. Also I need another Centaur, maybe drop a lapse. I'd change the s/b, dropping the Serenity for another Sleight (or metagame card _________). Also, I'd drop the Zur's for two Simoons. These work really well against monored (especially the 4 fireslinger version), white weenie, other 5cg, black, etc. After some more playing, I think that the Lapses aren't really that great. There aren't that many counterspells, and Lapse usually isn't that great against wrath, quake, etc. I think I'd drop the 4 lapses for a centaur, another terror, and two power sinks, but I haven't tested that change at all. Also, I'm in the extreme minority when I say that I think worbs suck in current T2. But they do! They're bad against bloom, propaganda, all weenie decks (including other 5cg, white weenie, etc), and not that good against monored. It's good against monoblue and r/u. Not enough justification to play it. Geddons, however, are amazing against all of the above decks. It's not quite as good against monoblue, but I shouldn't have that much trouble beating monoblue anyway. Anyway, I'm not sure if 5cg is the best possible deck. Decks with like Disks, Wraths, Earthquakes, Perishes, etc etc etc really hose this deck =( Although they aren't auto-wins either.. I've had people earthquake 3 of my creatures away, but then I just cast a 4/4 maro and win.. The reason I play 5cg is that 1) it's pretty consistant and versitile... you'll almost never lose to a clueless scrub. 2) it's good against the current field (here anyway) 3) it's fun to play! =-D I seriously think it's kind of dangerous playing almost any other major deck out there, as a lot of it is just rock-paper-scissors (although not that extreme). I think white weenie is pretty good, but not consistant enough, plus it really loses to GRANGER and firewalker and junk. If they kill like the 4 weenies you draw you're in like trouble =( ANYWAY, I get to WotC with my friend Will Hilts, who wanted to play 5cg too, but didn't have any of the commons or rares or anything. So he used his old monoblue deck.. I don't have the exact decklisting but it's something like this: 20 island 3 quicksand 3 air elemental 4 counterspell 4 dismiss 4 impulse 2 inspiration 1 whispers 2 capsize 4 man'o'war 4 ophidian 4 sapphire medallion 2 abduction 3 suq'ata firewalkers s/b is like 4 hydroblast, 3 boomerang, 1 firewalker, 4 disrupt, an abduction or two maybe.. etc, a bunch of crap =( I don't know how the deck wins, but he's like 10-1-2 before this tourney with it (his only loss to my 5cg).. I have never played it, but I'm guessing the inspirations are pretty crappy.. i'd add 2 more whispers instead.. Ohyeah, the tourney has a few more than 80 people, (about 20 of whom are wotc employees) and 7 rounds of swiss cutting to final 8. --- Round 1: WW empyrial armor First game I drop a 3/3 maro with him only having plains + adarkar out... he drops undiscovered + incinerate.. seems like everyone is playing like 5c-ww. Anyway, he armors a soltari priest + armor and I don't get a terror or disenchant and lose. Second game I get a quick granger and quick Maro.. he makes a mistake of blocking a 6/6 maro w/ a 1/1 and a biskelion and incinerating it while I have a quirion ranger out. 3 for none = amazing :-D Third game another early granger.. I get rid of his early knights.. terror/incinerate everything he casts.. he makes another mistake blocking a boa with a knight while I have a granger out.. (2/1 first striking regenerators are amazing vs. white weenie) 1-0 --- Round 2: Adam Conus (Adam!!! wotc netrep) w/ monored I see a bunch of fast vandals, keepers and fanatics (no jackal pups), but not much to back it up in midgame =\. My only land early on are a city and an undiscovered... He gets me down to 1 when I finally get my 3rd undiscovered out and geddon. I get him down from 20 to 0 before he can recover and do 1 to me =-D 2nd game, I don't get any creatures in my opening hand, but I manage to use removal on all his creatures, lapse some spell, then geddon. I recover quickly, get out a couple boas, centaur and maro. 2-0 --- Round 3: WotC d00d, GOBLINS 1st game, I see even more 1/1 dudes than round 2.. Soothsayers, new TE pumper goblins etc... I see a karplusan forest but no green.. I cast a Centaur and all the goblins stop.. =( This game looks really bad for him. 2nd game, I side out my disenchants. He casts a few goblins and a goblin warrens! 'cool' I think.. Next turn he casts an earthcraft and I say, 'ok'............. then it sinks in...ohwell. 3rd game, I side back the disenchants so I can stop the combo.... when it's just a bunch of goblins it's not hard for me to beat =\ In this round Will plays Tom Wylie playing a prop/orb deck with Azure Drakes and Chronatogs.. will wins =) 3-0 --- Round 4: Will Hilts Doesn't matter how big a tourney is, we're always paired together. He's knocked me out of qualifying for nationals, chicago, and getting a gp sf bye so far... but \/\/.. Since we're splitting, and he thinks I have a better deck, he offers me the win, but it's unsanctioned, and I feel I can do 2-1 at least easily anyway, so we do draw so he has a better chance of getting to finals. 3-0-1 --- Round 5: Monoblack bwatdown He plays a fallen askari and I start to worry.. this deck has trouble generally with black.. I manage to centaur/boa/geddon to win.. first game I side in sleights and a disenchant or something to get rid of my terrors. All I get are 1/1s. Luckily, he only drops some bad moons and doesn't get any creatures (besides fallen askari).. I sleight a bad moon to green and bwat him down.. 4-0-1 --- Round 6: Ricky Boyes, Sligh First game I mulligan once. He gets some creatures out early (including fireslinger) which I manage to get rid of.. he disks but I disenchant. I manage to geddon a win.. Second game is pretty much the same, but I draw 3 hydroblasts that help a lot.. 5-0-1 --- Round 7: Draw to get in final 8 5-0-2 --- Will loses the 6th round to the girl that I drew with last round.. he manages to win against a white weenie deck last round played by Lisa Stevens(?). So, the top 8 is as follows: 1) Victoria something(?) - Monored Burn w/ thunderbolts, disks etc 2) Jeremy Fuller (me) - 5CG 3) Ricky Boyes - 3CSligh 4) Will Hilts - Monoblue Medallion Crap 5) Jeff Fung(?) - 5CG w/worbs,manowars, no terrors standard 6) Terry Tsang - Black/Blue weenie with little removal + Teferi's Realm! 7) Mark Justice - White Weenie w/ red 8) Max Suver - White Weenie w/ red None of the WotC employees in top 8 =( Me and Will are in different brackets, and it looks like to me that if Will manages to pull off the first round, we have a good chance at both 1st and 2nd. My deck is really good against white weenie.. I'm sure it would do well against the black/blue and other 5CG (although I don't know exactly what's in it..)... it'd beat Will, and has an OK chance against the monored. --- Finals Round 1: Mark Justice - White Weenie w/ red First game, he gets out a few weenies which I manage to kill (except a soltari priest).. I get out a centaur and then a couple other creatures and manage to out-race him. Second game, he gets a 2nd turn Soltari Priest, 3rd turn Soltari Priest, and they go ALL THE WAY! He notes that I probably don't have a way to get rid of them =( when in fact I have 4 Terror + 4 Granger =-D None of which have shown up yet.. Third game, He casts a couple creatures early, which I manage to kill, and I get a Granger and Centaur out, which he earthquakes away. The game is looking VERY bad for me at this point. I cast a little Maro.. and he has a Knight of Dawn and pumpknight out.. Maro becomes 4/4, I geddon. He doesn't incinerate it, and Maro becomes big, I terror the dawnknight, and Maro wins. 6-0-2 --- Finals Round 2: Ricky Boyes - Sligh I start out with a mulligan. I hope this will be a repeat of the games before. Unfortunately, he gets out some creatures which I don't get the removal for. He gets me this game. After s/b, however, I think my deck is much stronger. I keep in the disenchants because I remember the first game disk from the swiss. I get a good start second game, killing all his early creatures, while I have two birds, a forest, and centaur out. He casts a fireslinger that I can't get rid of =(. He gets out a fanatic and a vandal.. He attacks with the Vandal.. I block, he pings me for 2 and earthquakes for one.. amazing card advantage! I don't draw anything else though, and he wins it. 6-1-2 --- I know, writing a tourney report about how you lost is dumb, but this deck could have easily won (I was capable of beating his deck, like I did in swiss, and if I did I'm sure I would have won), so hopefully that's some consolation.. Why'd I lose? Well, I knew monored would be one of the hardest decks to beat.. although I hate to blame it on luck, obviously if I win 2-0, then lose 0-2 to the same deck, there has to be a bit of luck involved.. Will lost first game to winter orb/5cg. Unfortunately, Winter Orb is better than geddon against monoblue (but that's about it..) So, we manage to split an amazing $50 each! When we left Jeff Fung was playing Max Suver in semis.. if I were to predict, I'd guess Ricky Boyes would beat Jeff Fung, but Max Suver would probably beat him. As for the semis match, it looked as though Suver was winning, but I'm not sure. What does this say about current T2? It's crappy. There's no dominant deck or decks.. a lot of the 'top' players around here.. Brian Wilson, Peter Radonjic, Ryan Fuller, Tim Kariel, Terry Lau, etc.. had bad starts and dropped early.. this T2 is definitely much different than earlier T2's.. I have a feeling that once it 'matures,' we'll see a difference.. I think Disk has probably the most potential of any card in the environment, but I don't have a genius solution on how to work it well. Anyway, keep in mind, you need to have a broad deck to be able to do well in current T2.. so far that's 5CG and white weenie.. and maybe sligh. While Bloom, Propaganda, etc, rage certain decks, they really are pretty limited. Anyway, I hope this generates some discussion on the current T2 environment.. -- Jeremy Fuller jfuller@olywa.net TheWurm on IRC -- The opinions expressed in this message are solely the personal views of the author and do not necessarily reflect the official views of your mom.