Subject: Re: SGD (fwd) Date: Wed, 8 Jul 1998 15:08:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Seth A Burn To: fkusumot@ix.netcom.com How The Stupid Green Deck came to be. I have tracked down the humble history of the Green deck. I drew up the first version of it on June 15th (I know it was then since that was the second Monday after the pre-release.) Here's the first version: 4 Winter's Grasps 4 Creeping Molds 4 Desert Twisters 4 Wastelands (The land destruction core that started the deck) 4 Walls of Roots 4 Walls of Blossoms (DEE-fense) 4 Llanowar Elves (Need fast mana) 4 Vineyards (How was I planning on casting Desert Twister?) 4 Spike feeders (Vineyard dump, strong card) 2 Spike Weavers (Fog is strong, mana dump) 4 Cursed Scrolls (Shadow Control, mana dump, Road to victory) 2 Stampeding Wildabeasts (Combo value, need at least a little beatdown) 2 Sex Monkeys (Kill Diamonds and Scrolls, combo well) 14 Forests (All I figured I needed) SB: 2 Sex monkeys 4 Emerald Charms 4 Gaea's Blessings 1 Sylvan Library 2 Jester's Caps 1 City of Solitude 1 Erratic Portal (So versitile) Pretty humble, wasn't it? I brought it along with a U/W Prison deck and a mono-Red Burn deck to Rob Kinyon's house to decktest against his 5cWW. I told Rob I wanted to play a fun deck and he bitched a bit about wanting to playtest against good decks. We played a tennis set (4 games unsideboarded, the rest sideboarded, if tied at 6-6, play a standard match of best 2/3 as the tiebreaker, got to get to six to win, win by 2, can win 7-5, yada, yada, yada) The match went 6-1 Green deck. yum. The next day I tested it against the Red deck: 6-0 Green. Played one more just to believe what I was seeing. 7-0. Being a nice metagame matchup vs. WW is one thing. Beating Sligh 7-0 is quite another. I broke out my Black speed deck at the Green deck won that matchup whenever the Black speed didn't draw a minimum of 2 Perish' out of the 3 in the board. 5-3 Black, but Black was getting incredible draws and the Green deck should win. I noticed a couple of things in this early testing: 1. I wanted more Spike Weavers and Wildabeasts. 2. Winter's Grasps were often the weakest card in my hand. No changes yet. I played against the Prison and wrecked it. I decided to cut the Grasps into the SB, cut the Caps, the Portal, and a Blessing, and add 2 Wildabeasts, a Weaver, and a Forest to the main deck. It wasn't getting mana-hosed by any means, but it was now becoming slightly more mana intensive. I tested the deck against a U/G/W Tradewind deck and lost 6-3. Here was a matchup where the Vineyards sucked, and my sb lacked answers. I didn't make any changes and resolved to find a solution. Other cards that were briefly in my SB were Disrupting Scepter, Ensnaring Bridge (I wanted to not worry about Perish), Lifeforce, and Choke. Winter's Grasps found their way back into the deck as soon as I realized that they were BUSTY vs. sligh. The land, a Weaver, a Wildabeasts, and a Wall of Roots left, with the idea that the deck was still not completed. Wednesday, July 1st came around and I flew to Columbus with 5 decks: U/G/W Tradewind, mono-Black, Red-Burn, 5cWW, and the Green. Keith Keeling liked the deck as soon as he saw me play it vs. Rob's WW. Keith played it in the open with the Grasps cut: 4 Vineyards 4 Scrolls 15 Forests 4 Wastelands 4 Molds 4 Twisters 3 Wildabeasts 4 Weavers 4 Feeders 2 Sex Monkeys 4 Elves 4 Blossoms 2 Roots 2 Blessings 2 Blessings 4 Charms 1 Sylvan 3 City of solitudes 2 Hurricanes 3 Lifeforces Keith played this deck twice, going 4-2. Yeash. Rob played this deck once and made it to the 5th round before dying to a U/R after losing games 2 and 3 because he left the Vineyards in. Mike Pustilnick played his U.S. open deck against me, losing 9-0 to my Sligh deck, but that really didn't matter since Mike is 0-10-1 against me in tourney's. He lost in the 4th round with it, switched to Bloom, and lost in the 4th round with that. Both Keith and Mike wanted to play my Green deck in the last U.S. Open. I was actually feeling pretty demoralized at the time. Keith and rob had been making at least 5 play mistakes every game and I couldn't blame them. I was used to the deck but they weren't, and it is very hard deck to play. I gave Mike the Green deck, and asked Keith the play a Tradewind deck. Scott Johns and I discussed deck theory for a while and he was intrigued by the deck. He realized that there was something wrong with it since it couldn't beat the tradewind decks. Keith lost early, and I went to the hotel to get some sleep with Mike in the 5th round. Next morning i return to find mike qualified and Scott with some new ideas. Scott has come up with 4 ideas: Scragnoth "God told me to play with Scragnoth, and it is good!", Static Orb for more anti-Tradewind, Reap against Black, and Null Broach against Black. Bryce Currence, a friend of mine from college, also had worked on the deck, and he rejected Reap. Scott decided to go trade for the cards. Aaron Wayne of Kentucky asked me about the deck and I gave it to him. Southern California, NY, and Kentucky decided to bring the deck with them on Saturday. I think Bryce gets the credit for thinking of Survival of the fittest. Bryce and Scott gave the deck to Brian Seldon and Adam Vieyra, as well as Ryan Kelly. Kelly had qualled through the U.S. open with a Black speed deck, but decided he rerally liked the Green tech. Going into Saturday Bryce was 4-1-1, Scott was 4-2, I was 4-2, Mike was 3-3 (and clinically delirious from lack of sleep.) I think Brian, Ryan, and Adam were all 4-2, but I'm not certain. Bryce came up with this: 4 Elves 4 Vineyards 4 Scrolls 3 Blossoms 4 Roots 1 Survival of the Fittest 3 Twisters 4 Molds 4 Wildabeasts 4 Weavers 4 Feeders 2 Monkeys 15 Forests 4 Wastelands 4 Winters Grasps 4 Emerald Charms 3 Scragnoths 2 Null Broach's 1 Sex Monkey 1 Survival of the Fittest Bryce and Scott independently decided to put the Grasps back in the sideboard, as did I. I was the one who knew the deck and realized that the Blossoms were the weaker wall. Scott convinced me that we wanted 4 Wildabeasts, and I think we all realized that Survival meant we only needed three Monkeys total. I went with 4 Twisters main deck, no survival main deck, only 1 Broach in the side, and 4 Scragnoths. Of all the versions of the the Green deck, Bryce's version was definitely the strongest as the main deck survival is correct, 3 twisters is presently the right amount (unless the environment changes, if so 2 might become more appropriate. I guess 2.6 is about right for this environment ;) Needle storm and Hurricane went into and out of the sideboard pretty quick. The Sylvan might actually be the one card with a good chance of returning to the deck since it combo's so well with survival. Obviously Bryce had the most success with the deck as he made the national team. The 4 Grasps are a neccessary sideboard card as they cement the advantage vs. Sligh and allow you to have a better than 55% chance after siding vs. Bloom. The Scragnoth's allow you to beatdown vs. Blue. If they have a wall, just add spikes and bust through. Busty! As far as I am concerned the Null Broach is very good, but may not be a permanent member of the sideboard. It is still very new, and does not obviously improve the deck the way the Scragnoth's did. Survival of the Fittest is wonderful in the deck, but 2 standard might be 1 more than neccessary. Here's how to play the deck: Vs. WW, and Black weenie: Drop Vineyards, Elves, and Walls as fast as you can. You want to build up a defense. Get Scroll or infinite fog going (infinite fog is with Spike Weaver-Stampeding Wildabeasts). Once you have stablized, kill with big Wildabeasts, Scroll, or Vineyard. Use your Molds and Twisters to either take away needed mana or kill Scrolls (first and most important target), or creature enhancers. It will take some time to learn exactly how to play the deck since there are so many decisions. Gn beats these about 75% Vs. Sligh: Barring a bad draw you should be able to grab solid board control in similar fashion as versus the other weenies. again, kill all scrolls. Land destruction should be sided in to give you a massive edge in games 2 and 3. Gn. beats sligh about 80%. Vs. Bloom: Either play the vineyard on turn 1 or not at all in game 1. Go agro and hope. You will only win 25% of the time in game one. Side in 4 Charms, 4 Grasps, and 2 Broach's. The added disruption should force the Bloom player to take some risks with the enchantments. kill them and roll to victory. You have about a 63% chance after siding. Overall Gn. vs. Bloom is an even matchup if the Green has a solid board. Gn. vs. Blue bounce: Game 1 is tough. Don't drop the Vineyard, and hope for a lot of molds and Monkey's. Side in the Scrags, Survival, Broach's, and Grasps and again go for disruption and beatdown mix. Gn. vs. Gn: Agree to a draw. If that fails whomever draws the Wildabeasts with Blossoms and mana first wins. A stall is actually quite likely with Spike Weavers, but choose wisely between Twistering the Weaver and Beasts. Most often kill the weaver, but not if the beast is the only way they have of keeping weaver out of Scroll range. Side out vineyards for Survival, Monkey, and either Broach's or Grasps. Gn. vs. Oath of Druids: Your game 1 draw determines how you should play. If you draw Vineyards and Scrolls, hold the creatures. If you have lots of enchantment destruction, go for a rush. In games 2 and 3 your extra control should give you a sizeable edge. Gn. vs. El Nino: U/G/W Tradewind is hell for Gn. Get lucky in game 1, and hope for big Scragnoth's in game 2. This deck actually takes a little time to learn to play. It isn't a beatdown deck, it's Green control. Play it accordingly, and you'll be fine. I only went 1-2 with the deck because I played a pair of tradewind decks and got hosed. I played Steve 'OMS in round 7 and beat his 5cWW 2-1 to go to 5-2, but then I took a pair of bullets for the team. Anyway, here are many, many props, and one slop: Props: Sensai Pooh: For providing silent inspiration and encouragement, as well as discipline whenever neccessary. Bryce Currence: You da' MAN! G'luck at worlds. If I come up with anything, I'll let you know. ;) Scott Johns: Some tough draws clearly hurt you. Sorry about that. You did a nice job of improving the deck so that it was able to be a consistent tier 1 deck. Scragnoth! Mike Long: Nope, you're not getting props for making the national team. You get props for "Audacious!" Ryan Kelly: Tough breaks man. Ballsy move going away from a deck that qualled you in the open. I just wish that we would have had some more time on Friday night to help everyone get the sideboard right. Still, mad props for going from the US Open to the top 8. Matt Linde: Obvious props for being our national champ. Nice job consistently ducking the SGD ;) John Finkel: That match between you and Mike was hilarious. I'm glad that you were able to recover and represent the Northeast in Seattle. Alan Comer: 2 seperate props: 1. Props for that silly extended deck that put the seeds in my head for this deck. 2. MASSIVE props (and thanks) for giving me and Mike the ride to the hotel. Muchos Gracias Amigo. Adam Veiyra: Props for lending Alan the car so we Mike could get home. Thanx man. Rob Kinyon: For losing 6-1 to the Gn. deck thus starting the snowball that went to Hell and back. Other assorted props for playtesting, advice, etc... One big thing: You realized quickly that Oath of Leiges was weak. If you don't do that, I don't bother with LD. Keith Keeling: Props for having more faith in the deck than anyone, even when it was at its nadir. My VCR: YES! It freaking worked! I successfully programmed it to tape episodes 3-5 of the X-Files! You da' MACHINE! Sean Mckeown: Guess which cards we used. Alan Neumon: Thanx for lending me the Scragnoth's. I'm sorry they were not the Scrognoth's that ended up delivering a few beatings. Anthony Cantu: Ireland! I hear they have some BUSTY women up there. Richard Aaron Wayne: At least this was better than that stupid U/W deck that I sent you to LA with... lol. Props for getting into to nationals with a deck of mine, and running another one while here. Mike Pustilnick: Mad props for almost going 13-0 with the deck. 7 wins through the open, and 5-0 going into last round in the Nationals. To bad you had to face Brian Seldon's Gn. deck and watch him get better draws. If you hadn't been up all night in the 8:00 P.M. open you would have easily made top 8 with your skills. Adrian Sullivan: Deckbuilders unite! Viva the deckbuilders! Brian Seldon: #9 is tough. Gn. decks in 4th, 8th, and 9nth is nice, but it sux to be the 9. Sorry about that, but props for doing very well. David Wintheiser: Props for going through the open and dancing with the girl that brought you. So where are all the Maro? Jimi Hendrix: I was listening to you when the deck was built. Denis Leary: I was listening to you when the deck was playtested. Slops: The guy who stole Aaron Wayne's deck: You are scum. You might have convinced many other people otherwise, but trust me, you are scum, and I think you know it. Red: I guess there are only 4 colors in Magic know locking at the decks that made the national team. ;) I guess now there will be a ton of people bitching at WotC that Red is way too weak. LOL! Some side notes... Was I the only one offended by chicks dressed up in fantasy negligee (basically) to take pictures with guys for money?... WotC needs to staff the opens better. For $20 a head they should be able to... I flew up with Steve 'OMS. I'm pretty sure I asked him to play and that he declined. There were also a couple of people practicing drafting to my left. I asked them if they wanted to play Type II and they said they had to practice their drafting skills. They told me that IF they qualified for nationals they needed this practice. I guess life might have turned out differently had you chosen to practice Type II on the plane and drafting later... I think Rath Cycle constructed will NOT be dominated by Blue the way a lot of people think it will. Yes mono-Blue is strong, but it has some nasty foils such as WW with U and 5cG... Poor Peter Leiher- Same deck as Mike Long, slightly different results. Pairings are huge... Poor Andrew Pacifico and Dave Price- I guess this was not an easy top 8 for Sligh... WTF happenned with Necro? Necro-Dungeon looked OK in my playtesting... I know I'm forgetting a ton, but feel free to e-mail me if you have any questions, comments, flames, or whatever. Later... Seth Burn (Apparent Team Captian of Pooh and Friends. Don't worry, I'm not getting uppity, I know Sensai Pooh is Lord and Master of Pooh and Friends.)